(Re)Enable macosx top menu bar on fullscreen (VB 3.1.0)

Discussions related to using VirtualBox on Mac OS X hosts.

(Re)Enable macosx top menu bar on fullscreen (VB 3.1.0)

Postby ecterrab » 1. Dec 2009, 23:35

I noticed that in VB 3.1.0 the macosx dock and top menu bar, that would appear when hovering the mouse close to top of the screen in fullscreen mode, do not appear anymore. I read in the changelog that this is a "fix" to bug #4866. But in that bug report, what is requested is only an option to not autoshow the macosx menubar. What is provided in 3.1.0, however, is not an option: the macosx dock and menubar are not displayed anymore in full screen and apparently there is just no way to make them visible again as in VB before 3.1.0.

Although some people may prefer to work that way, aI note also that for people that are mac and use VB with a guest heavily for work for instance, the new design is inconvenient: it makes the guest be less integrated to the host. Before 3.1.0, we were able to just hover the top to automatically see the macosx menubar with it all the macosx menulets and dock, no need to touch the keybord for that, nor to hide them after giving a rapid look at the dock - and in that way have instant and direct access to the specific macosx applications that we use all the time as well as instantly see whether we have mail and etc. useful info that mac conveys through the doc. All that without having to switch guest -> host -> guest using the keyboard. In brief: this "auto show the menubar and dock in fullscreen" is one of the most appreciated features of VB (for many of mac & VB users like me at least), especially when comparing VB with VMWare and Parallels.

So could this "auto show the menubar and dock in fullscreen" be offered again as an option? In this way everybody will be happy, including all of us that prefer a bit more of integration Host <-> Guest (in the sense explained above) instead of a bit more of screen display. In some sense it appears to me that this is the same design issue of the mac-dock or windows-taskbar, both provide auto-hide as an option.

Thanks

Edgardo
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Re: (Re)Enable macosx top menu bar on fullscreen (VB 3.1.0)

Postby jkgm » 1. Dec 2009, 23:49

I too was very disappointed to find that the Mac host menu bar is completely gone in 3.1.0. This is such a critical feature that I had to completely uninstall the guest tools and host VirtualBox and revert to 3.0.12 to continue working. Please return the pop-down menu bar as soon as possible!
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Re: (Re)Enable macosx top menu bar on fullscreen (VB 3.1.0)

Postby HipHoppity » 2. Dec 2009, 03:37

Hi Edgardo,

I also missed this feature as soon as I upgraded from VBox 3.0.12 to version 3.1.0. You've done a nice job summarizing the issue for those of us that like to use the full screen mode. Thanks for starting this discussion.

You might want to consider adding your comments to the Discuss VirtualBox 3.1.0 Release thread => http://forums.virtualbox.org/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=25311

The other option is to add this to the Bugtracker => http://www.virtualbox.org/wiki/Bugtracker

If you decide to go that route, let us know here and I'd be happy to pile-on with your effort to revive the top menu bar in VBox 3.1 !
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Re: (Re)Enable macosx top menu bar on fullscreen (VB 3.1.0)

Postby ecterrab » 2. Dec 2009, 08:47

Hi
I had already tracked it (#5636) before you posted. I didn't know about the "discuss 3.1.0" thread though - many thanks - I reposted there, adding a couple of comments on other issues as well. I don't know whether it is technically complicated but from the point of view of usability it is reasonable to have the previous design as an option; just think the amount of people who used VB till today on the mac, every day, hours per day, and without ever considering that interface design as a "bug".

Best
Edgardo
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Re: (Re)Enable macosx top menu bar on fullscreen (VB 3.1.0)

Postby Sasquatch » 2. Dec 2009, 11:18

from 3.1.0 release discussion wrote:The reason the top bar is no longer showing is because VB now acts like a normal full screen application. When you watch a video in full screen, do you have the option to show the top bar or not? I don't think so. Users always have something to complain about. First it's the bar in the way and they want it gone, now that it's gone, they want it back. Make up your mind already! It's these Mac users that give me a totally wrong idea about the general Mac user (way too arrogant IMO).
Read the Forum Posting Guide before opening a topic.
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Re: (Re)Enable macosx top menu bar on fullscreen (VB 3.1.0)

Postby poetzsch » 2. Dec 2009, 18:04

See viewtopic.php?f=1&t=25311 for a statement of me.
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Re: (Re)Enable macosx top menu bar on fullscreen (VB 3.1.0)

Postby HipHoppity » 2. Dec 2009, 18:41

Hi Poetzsch,

I appreciate your comments on the menu bar changes. It was interesting to learn that the auto-show menu bar in pre VBox 3.1.0 builds was an unintended behavior. My experience with Virtualbox is only with Mac Hosts -- so it was helpful to understand some of the decision making that went into this change. After working with VBox for awhile now, I have grown to appreciate this serendipitous "feature".

Please consider returning this behavior in an upcoming build of the Virtualbox 3.1 branch as an optional feature. Edgardo has done a nice job in summarizing my views on this topic.
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Re: (Re)Enable macosx top menu bar on fullscreen (VB 3.1.0)

Postby ukchucktown » 2. Dec 2009, 23:57

Full screen is full screen. If you need access to the menu bar and dock use a maximized window instead. I barely notice the difference between a maximized window and full screen except for the dock and menu bar access. You are not going to make everyone happy. VMWare Fusion works the same way, no menu bar or dock access in full screen. A toggle setting would be nice, and I don't think it's arrogant to request enhancements, but this is way down on the priority list if you ask me.
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Re: (Re)Enable macosx top menu bar on fullscreen (VB 3.1.0)

Postby jkgm » 10. Dec 2009, 22:13

Sasquatch wrote:When you watch a video in full screen, do you have the option to show the top bar or not? I don't think so

Actually, the Mac OS X menubar DOES appear on hover in Quicktime player's full-screen mode.
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Re: (Re)Enable macosx top menu bar on fullscreen (VB 3.1.0)

Postby ptram » 11. Dec 2009, 13:48

Other good examples of full screen mode, with menubar appearing when the mouse pointer moves over it, are WriteRoom and Scrivener, the epitomes of full screen on the Mac. They act exactly as VirtualBox did before the 'fix'.

The menubar is the vital part of the Mac's interface, so it should be easily accessible when needed. If someone is using VirtualBox instead of a real PC, it is probably because a mixed environment is needed.

Paolo
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Re: (Re)Enable macosx top menu bar on fullscreen (VB 3.1.0)

Postby DCMacGuy » 11. Dec 2009, 15:34

This is mildly ridiculous and should be something that we can turn on and off at will.

I run dual displays, and have my second display set as a VM running full screen. I need to be able to bounce back and forth, or see alerts that pop up on the dock. As soon as I click into my VM, everything disappears on my primary Mac display. It requires multiple clicks to do anything, and has already caused several problems with a workflow.

This is a dealbreaker - it needs to be fixed.
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Re: (Re)Enable macosx top menu bar on fullscreen (VB 3.1.0)

Postby HipHoppity » 11. Dec 2009, 20:21

Update

Poetzsch has included an option for showing the Dock & Menubar in the next build of VBox 3.1.

See Bugtracker Ticket #5636 => http://www.virtualbox.org/ticket/5636

Thank you Poetzsch -- I appreciate it!
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Re: (Re)Enable macosx top menu bar on fullscreen (VB 3.1.0)

Postby ptram » 13. Dec 2009, 17:10

Thank you Poetzsch!
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Re: (Re)Enable macosx top menu bar on fullscreen (VB 3.1.0)

Postby ecterrab » 17. Dec 2009, 19:25

(original post in Discuss VirtualBox 3.1.0)
Hi
I just tried 3.1.2, host = mac, guest = windows xp 32 bit. I appreciate the intention of bringing back the autoshow the mac menubar and dock, but what I see in 3.1.2 is not what was there in 3.0.12, and it is not satisfactory at least for me. Details: in 3.0.12 and previous releases, hovering the top of the screen shows the mac "menubar and dock". That got removed in 3.1.0 and was requested to be an option (expected for 3.1.2). What we got in 3.1.2: hovering the top only shows the menubar, not the dock (expected: also shows the dock) and in addition (new) hovering the bottom (typically to see the windows or other OS taskbar) now shows (on top of the taskbar) the mac dock (expected: it does not show the dock, only the taskbar). I don't know but can guess (sorry if I am wrong) that this is intentional. The problem with this new change in design is that instead of having the mac panels (menubar and dock) related to one sector of the screen (top) and the windows panels (taskbar) in another sector (bottom), we have now everything mixed. So if I want to have access to the mac applications and info I need to hover 2 regions (top and bottom) and in addition each time I hover the bottom to have access to the windows taskbar (bottom) I see on top of it the mac dock.

Please, is there any way that the behavior of 3.0.12, that is also the one in previous VB releases, that people asked as an option, be made as an option? (I mean without changing the design as I see it got changed in 3.1.2). Many thanks in advance.
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Re: (Re)Enable macosx top menu bar on fullscreen (VB 3.1.0)

Postby ptram » 9. Jan 2010, 13:21

While I'm grateful to the developers for implementing the requested change, I'm also not very happy with the current implementation.

My guess: as in 3.1.10, don't let the mouse hovering show the Mac toolbar and dock. Allow a key combination (Host + something), or Host + mouse hovering, to show the Mac toolbar and dock. This would be a temporary, intentional release of the mouse from the guest.

Paolo
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