Windows 10 freezing after login

Discussions about using Windows guests in VirtualBox.
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virtualgus
Posts: 9
Joined: 16. Dec 2014, 17:40

Windows 10 freezing after login

Post by virtualgus »

After normal start, after login into my user account, it seems it will run normally. But at some point Windows freezes, usually with Steam verifying update (tried to cancel) and also with a message to update Guest Additions.
I also tried to use a backup of the entire folder (CCC do dayly backup), same thing.
I shut it down and saved the log, but I had to zip it because will blow up the attachment limit.
Any ideas?
Attachments
Windows10-2022-01-05-20-46-07.log.zip
(34.12 KiB) Downloaded 16 times
scottgus1
Site Moderator
Posts: 20965
Joined: 30. Dec 2009, 20:14
Primary OS: MS Windows 10
VBox Version: PUEL
Guest OSses: Windows, Linux

Re: Windows 10 freezing after login

Post by scottgus1 »

Zipped logs are heartily accepted and recommended.

Host RAM is too low for the VM's settings:
00:00:03.507450 Host RAM: 8192MB (8.0GB) total, 2960MB (2.8GB) available
00:00:03.791799 RamSize <integer> = 0x0000000100000000 (4 294 967 296, 4 096 MB, 4.0 GB)
00:00:03.792487 VRamSize <integer> = 0x0000000008000000 (134 217 728, 128 MB)
Reduce VM RAM or shut off host programs to release enough host RAM.

VM processors are same as host CPU count (Hypertheading doesn't help VM performance much):
Host CPU status:
00:00:04.359357 CPUM: Logical host processors: 4 present, 4 max, 4 online, online mask: 000000000000000f
00:00:04.359362 CPUM: Physical host cores: 2
00:00:04.359679 Full Name: " Intel(R) Core(TM) i5-3210M CPU @ 2.50GHz"
Guest CPU settings:
00:00:03.791794 NumCPUs <integer> = 0x0000000000000002 (2)
If the VM takes lots of CPU the performance may suffer. But there's not much you can do about this one on this host. Windows 10 does not run well with only one processor.

This host may struggle to run Mac OS and Windows 10 smoothly at the same time. Try the RAM adjustment, then see what happens.
virtualgus
Posts: 9
Joined: 16. Dec 2014, 17:40

Re: Windows 10 freezing after login

Post by virtualgus »

I did some clean in host memory and both host and guest Win10 really worked better. But Windows still freezes at the same point. Now it was able to complete Steam task, but stopped with the Guest Additions notice (screenshot attached).
Curious fact: the state it is not really freeze, because after a while (half hour) the notice disappeared. So it might be only irresponsible to inputs or near 100% CPU usage. Maybe Windows have updated some driver that is causing this "quantum" state, but I am a bit rusty on this. Maybe I should look for Windows logs... Any tips?

By the way: I will make sure my next note will have 16GB of RAM, 8GB is almost a miracle to run both Big Sur and Windows...
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VirtualBox_Windows10_06_01_2022_17_28_39.jpg
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scottgus1
Site Moderator
Posts: 20965
Joined: 30. Dec 2009, 20:14
Primary OS: MS Windows 10
VBox Version: PUEL
Guest OSses: Windows, Linux

Re: Windows 10 freezing after login

Post by scottgus1 »

virtualgus wrote:Curious fact: the state it is not really freeze, because after a while (half hour) the notice disappeared. So it might be only irresponsible to inputs or near 100% CPU usage.
Use the VM's Task Manager to check on this. If this VM goes 105% on the reactor, it might slog down the host's ability to process the VM's needs, since it's really the host running the VM's OS, and your host doesn't have anything left to run on.
virtualgus
Posts: 9
Joined: 16. Dec 2014, 17:40

Re: Windows 10 freezing after login

Post by virtualgus »

I have tried Windows tools. By entering safe mode, I did run sfc /scannow and also chkdsk /f, some fixes were made, so there was some corrupted files.

I have VirtualBox Manager and Guest Additions in older version than VirtualBox 6.1.30. I think there is some conflict or malfunction. By entering safe mode I could download both installers, but only Guest Additions could be installed. The manager cannot be installed in safe mode, and in normal mode it will freeze when Windows require user authorization to proceed. Also, I could not uninstall this Manager... it looks like a dead end!
mpack
Site Moderator
Posts: 39156
Joined: 4. Sep 2008, 17:09
Primary OS: MS Windows 10
VBox Version: PUEL
Guest OSses: Mostly XP

Re: Windows 10 freezing after login

Post by mpack »

If you want us to update our comments you need to provide an updated log showing that you attended to the issues already raised.
virtualgus
Posts: 9
Joined: 16. Dec 2014, 17:40

Re: Windows 10 freezing after login

Post by virtualgus »

mpack wrote:If you want us to update our comments you need to provide an updated log showing that you attended to the issues already raised.
I did the memory adjustments already. Forgot to mention my host does not go 105% of VM usage during tests.
But this is just to improve the performance, does not affect the real problem. I am just trying other possibilities since nothing else was suggested. It seems there is a conflict with Guest Manager version and Virtual Box version. I don't know how to get some Windows log to investigate this...
scottgus1
Site Moderator
Posts: 20965
Joined: 30. Dec 2009, 20:14
Primary OS: MS Windows 10
VBox Version: PUEL
Guest OSses: Windows, Linux

Re: Windows 10 freezing after login

Post by scottgus1 »

virtualgus wrote:I don't know how to get some Windows log to investigate this
We'd want to look at a new VM log, like the one you attached in your first post in this topic, to see what the suggested changes did to the VM.
virtualgus wrote:my host does not go 105% of VM usage during tests.
"105% on the reactor" was a tongue-in-cheek reference (a la The Hunt for Red October) to full processor usage in the VM possibly causing host stability on this low-provisioned host.
virtualgus wrote:It seems there is a conflict with Guest Manager Additions version and Virtual Box version.
It's a computer, and Windows at that, so anything technically can happen. But if it was happening the way you theorize, it would happen on a lot more Windows guests, Windows being a rather-commonly-used OS. And it hasn't. In other words, none of this has been done in a corner. The forums would have blown up over it, and they haven't. So it's not likely to be a conflict between Guest Additions and Windows 10. More likely to be a host that can't handle the VM.

But there is a way to test: make a new Windows 10 VM. Install 10, don't activate it, and try to install the Guest Additions. If they install well in the new VM, then the old VM OS has a glitch. If the GAs install is slow again, then it could still be the host being too week, but not likely Windows 10 incompatibilities.

Please provide a new VM log showing the adjustments you made.
virtualgus
Posts: 9
Joined: 16. Dec 2014, 17:40

Re: Windows 10 freezing after login

Post by virtualgus »

Now that I am trying to get a log after freezing, it's not freezing anymore! But here is what I am trying to show in the picture:
There is two Virtual Box apps installed, the "Additions" is already updated. The other I will try to update now that Windows is working. Maybe in the last time the update of Additions was not 100% in effect yet, and now it is - just a theory.
Attachments
Captura de Tela 2022-01-12 às 08.55.14.png
Captura de Tela 2022-01-12 às 08.55.14.png (86.9 KiB) Viewed 9098 times
virtualgus
Posts: 9
Joined: 16. Dec 2014, 17:40

Re: Windows 10 freezing after login

Post by virtualgus »

Yes! Freeze again when trying to install the updated Virtual Box (as in the picture). And is the log is attached.
Captura de Tela 2022-01-12 às 11.54.12.png
Captura de Tela 2022-01-12 às 11.54.12.png (51.5 KiB) Viewed 9097 times
Attachments
Windows10-2022-01-12-11-54-50.log.zip
(34.55 KiB) Downloaded 5 times
scottgus1
Site Moderator
Posts: 20965
Joined: 30. Dec 2009, 20:14
Primary OS: MS Windows 10
VBox Version: PUEL
Guest OSses: Windows, Linux

Re: Windows 10 freezing after login

Post by scottgus1 »

RAM settings:
00:00:04.722270 Host RAM: 8192MB (8.0GB) total, 2694MB (2.6GB) available
00:00:05.123311 RamSize <integer> = 0x0000000100000000 (4 294 967 296, 4 096 MB, 4.0 GB)
Your VM is still demanding too much RAM for this host. Reduce the VM's RAM to 2GB. Windows 10 performance will be slower on this host, though it shouldn't necessarily seize up.

Only the Guest Additions should be installed in the VM. Installing Virtualbox in the VM is not necessary, except if you want to try nested virtualization, and there's no way you could do nested virtualization on this host. Uninstall Virtualbox from Windows 10.

Keep the Task Manager open in the VM, set to show which app is using max CPU usage. When the VM OS seems to freeze, see what Task Manager says is going on.

After adjusting the VM RAM and uninstalling Virtualbox from the VM, post a new VM log, and what apps are at the top of the Task Manager's max CPU display.
virtualgus
Posts: 9
Joined: 16. Dec 2014, 17:40

Re: Windows 10 freezing after login

Post by virtualgus »

Your VM is still demanding too much RAM for this host. Reduce the VM's RAM to 2GB. Windows 10 performance will be slower on this host, though it shouldn't necessarily seize up.
Can't reduce the RAM of this Windows 10 because there is some Windows software demanding at list 4GB, as Polyboard (is the only software I have to make my forniture projects).
Only the Guest Additions should be installed in the VM. Installing Virtualbox in the VM is not necessary, except if you want to try nested virtualization, and there's no way you could do nested virtualization on this host. Uninstall Virtualbox from Windows 10.
Tried to unistall it again and Windows have freezed with the prompt box "Are you sure want to uninstall Oracle VM VirtualBox 6.1.26?". I tried to get a screenshot but Task Manager became blank! I remember only 10% of CPU usage and 35% of memory. I have to remove this thing out of my VM! Maybe I can do it manually deleting files and registry entries. Do you know how or maybe I should open a new topic about it?
Keep the Task Manager open in the VM, set to show which app is using max CPU usage. When the VM OS seems to freeze, see what Task Manager says is going on.
After adjusting the VM RAM and uninstalling Virtualbox from the VM, post a new VM log, and what apps are at the top of the Task Manager's max CPU display.
It is blank! It's not freeze really, some kind of loop, maybe some code with high privilege is still being executed. But keyboard and mouse are not responding. Also the clock is stopped.

I know I am not helping you to help me, sorry, I am also full of work with a problematic website I am developping. At list macOS BigSur is very stable and reliable... I should believe me, it runs this VM in a separated monitor and there is no problem working with other apps opened in the host, as Chrome is opened with 9 tabs now.
scottgus1
Site Moderator
Posts: 20965
Joined: 30. Dec 2009, 20:14
Primary OS: MS Windows 10
VBox Version: PUEL
Guest OSses: Windows, Linux

Re: Windows 10 freezing after login

Post by scottgus1 »

virtualgus wrote:I know I am not helping you to help me, sorry,
No problem! We're still glad to help.
virtualgus wrote:Can't reduce the RAM of this Windows 10
OK. But you can't have the cake and eat it too. The RAM for the VM has to come from the host, and the host doesn't have it.

I don't know for certain if the RAM issue is causing the freezes. But it could, and until we can get a log from a run of the VM that freezes while reporting its full RAM available from the host, we won't know.

Try to reboot the host, then start the VM first. Then look at the log for the "Host RAM:...available" line, quoted above, at the top of the log. The log can be seen while the VM is running. If it shows more than 4GB RAM available, then watch that run of the VM for freezes (don't bother trying to uninstall Virtualbox for now). Start your 4GB-requiring app, see what the VM does. Post the log if it freezes.

If after a host reboot you cannot get more than 4GB RAM available in the log, then this host has too much demanded of it by the host OS and can't run this VM in the present host configuration. More host RAM could be useful.
virtualgus wrote:At list macOS BigSur is very stable and reliable... I should believe me, it runs this VM in a separated monitor and there is no problem working with other apps opened in the host, as Chrome is opened with 9 tabs now.
I'll suspect that "at list" means some other Mac host where the VM runs well. If you copied the working VM on the other host to this host, or from this host to the other host, then this would tend to incriminate this host as the cause of the freeze. If the other host's VM is a fresh install and not a copy of this VM, then the performance of one might not indicate performance of the other, due to possible glitches between the VMs.
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